Suggestion: remove min skill 200 for Ikkinz 4 research combine

The Ikkinz 4 raid requires making Engraved Rune (research, min skill 200, trivial 200). Please consider removing the minimum skill for this combine. Leaving the trivial of 200 in place still incentivizes skilling up as high as possible to avoid failing the raid on a combine attempt, but removes an enormous and unnecessary road block in actually requiring a researcher to be that high.

Reason #1: I can't find any info anywhere online that states there is a minimum required skill for this combine.

• EQProgression says to have a 200+ researcher loot and do the combine, but doesn't mention a min skill.
• Rasper's Realm doesn't mention it at all.
• Zam says explicitly at the top of the quest writeup "no skill required."
• EQ Might says you should have a 100+ researcher, but doesn't mention min skill
• Bonzz mentions 200+ researcher but not a min skill

Reason #2: It seems that in the past out-of-era recipes were available to skill up research past 200 relatively easily (following a guide like this) but now getting to 200+ research is extremely time prohibitive. So this 200+ research road block used to be a minor time / plat sink, but now it's a huuuugge and unintended hurdle to progression.

Gathering enough pages to skill research to 200+ for exactly 1 progression step in the game is simply not worth the time. It makes Gates of Discord progression either not worth the time required and you just skip to Omens, or you get the help of someone else to tag along who is already 200+ from, most likely, the previous implementation of out-of-era recipes.

 

Just as an FYI, You can make swatches to 152, it's a lot less time/plat sink. There are books sold that will add recipes to your research book recipe list. Past that yeah it's a grind.

 

What type of swatches to 152? Mind clarifying that a bit more?

 

Hi all

I haven't been playing for a while so not sure what changed. But these are the research recipes I used to skill up. Vendor items all in PoK.

They are Original & Kunark era, so they should not have been removed?

# SKILL PATH
1-21: Train at GM

22-54: Vial of Pure Water
5x Empty Vial (Eric Rasumus)
4x Water Flash (Eric Rasumus)
Gnomish Heat Source (Eric Rasumus)
/echo [332] autobuy "Empty Vial"|100/"Gnomish Heat Source"|25/"Water Flask"|80


55-102: Aqua Regia (ALSO SOLD IN POK 146p)
Aqua Fortis (71p) - Eric Rasumus
Vial of Muratic Acid (75p) - Eric Rasumus
/echo [332] autobuy "Aqua Fortis"|100/"Vial of Muratic Acid"|100


103-203 Vellum Parchment Solution

3x Gnomish Heat Source (Audri Deepfacet)
3x Gold Bar (Audri Deepfacet)
Platinum Bar (Audri Deepfacet)
Vial of Pure Water (subcombine) - SEE ABOVE
Aqua Regia - SEE ABOVE / WHEN YOU RUN OUT JUST BUY MORE DONT NEED TO MAKE

/echo [438] autobuy "Gnomish Heat Source"|360/"Gold Bar"|360/"Platinum Bar"|120
/echo [332] autobuy "Aqua Regia"|120

 

These recipes were implemented with a big overhaul to research in the Depths of Darkhollow expansion, haven’t found a date or patch notes yet but it’s mentioned at the top of this page

 

There are a bunch of combines using game-wide drops (runes, words, pages, other random stuff) to make swatches. Abrogation Scried Swatch, Ellipse Runed Swatch, etc

But these only go to 152. Past that you gotta actually make spells by collecting rare or random drops.

 

Ah, I see.

Item was added to live and scraped by lucy in 2005-09-24 (Depths of Darkhollow):
https://lucy.allakhazam.com/itemhistory.html?id=93505

 

you also have option from 0 to 182 to do research runes (Practice, Training, Journeyman, Study, Expert, Master and Magi) but I find them to be a pain as the sub combines don't show up as a recipe so you can't use /autocombine on it. So I just search for best spell that I can get drops for and just farm it as much as possible.
"What type of swatches to 152? Mind clarifying that a bit more?"
Etched, Runed or Scribed Swatches, they are used for robes for certain races but you only need 1 drop to get skill ups (+ bought quill and parchment)
there is 30+ of them, skills 92 to 152. Again buy the swatches book (I forget who sells it) and I think the recipes get added to your tradeskill window.
Some classes you can find easy items for skill ups. Example Mages can make Spell: Scars of Sigil to 196 which is quill, parchment, Bolts of Tallon and Words of Domination. Words of Domination drop alot in Sirens grotto and Chardok. Bolts of Tallon drop like crazy in Temple of Cazic Thule.

 

According to eqtraders the trivial is greater than 190.

Engraved Rune
item|sources|full list
Recipe(s):
Spell Research Components: Runed Glyph: Aexit, Runed Glyph: Grexit, Runed Glyph: Noxit, Runed Glyph: Truxit
In: Phantasmal Tome, Arch Magus Grimoire, Warlock's Book of Binding, Sorcerer's Lexicon
Yield: 1
This combine may only be made by Select classes, see notes below
Notes: This combine can be made by int casters in their class specific container.
Trivial at: <=190

http://www.eqtraders.com/items/show_item.php?item=13056&menustr=035000000000

 

"Trivial at: <=190"

This means "less than or equal to 190". All that confirms is that someone at research skill 190 attempted the combine and got a notification that they could no longer skill up from this combine.

This would confirm that 200 is too high of a trivial.

 

What's the data source that confirmed 200 as a "required" skill anyways?

 

Lots of datapoints:

2010: https://web.archive.org/web/20100823150751/http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=56039



2015: https://web.archive.org/web/20150922134744/http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=56039

Current: https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/recipe.html?recipe=21257 - This shows the Minimum (number) and trival separate as well as the first date entry on zam.




EQProgression calling out 200+: https://www.eqprogression.com/ikkinz-raid-trial-4-antechamber-of-destruction-gates-of-discord/

 

+1, appreciate the transparency and I think it helps understand the decision making. Even current ZAM shows "minimum skill required 200": https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=56039 So it seems like it's always been this way.

 

Hate to see it haha. The outcome is still a bummer for an emu server where the economy for tradeskill items is vastly different than live, but thanks for sharing those sources

 

Re: What swatches---- here you go.
I've found that The Deep is a nice spot to AE for the single ingredients, got a lot of tears of prexus, wing of xegony, and runes of tempest...although now kicking myself because I need the runes of tempest for higher level research.

I'm also having significant difficulty getting spell research combines that -should- work to work.... -_-

 

Thanks for the list, this is awesome!

 

Here's a rune list (wiz) that might be helpful. I have to work on lists for necro, mage and enc.
The number is the highest skill that the rune can be used to create something with. example Rune of Falhalem only has combines up to skill 26, after that you can just not loot, sell to a vendor or save for another wizard. Included are Runes for the prequest.

11738 Rune of Falhalem 26
11740 Rune of Periphery 26
11741 Rune of Fulguration 26
11742 Rune of Proximity 26
11743 Rune of Neglect 41
11744 Rune of Oppression 41
11745 Rune of Velious 46
11747 Rune of Expulsion 62
11749 Rune of Presence 71
11750 Rune of Disassociation 71
11751 Rune of Trauma 71
11752 Rune of Xegony 96
11753 Rune of Karana 96
11755 Rune of Dismemberment 96
11756 Rune of Regeneration 96
11757 Rune of Rallos Zek 96
11759 Rune of Fulguration 96
---------
11766 Rune of Solusek Ro 120
11767 Rune of the Cyclone 120
11768 Rune of Howling 120
11769 Rune of Contortion 120
11760 Rune of Consumption 122
11761 Rune of Sorcery 122
11762 Rune of Arrest 122
11764 Rune of Banding 122
11765 Rune of the Catalyst 122
11746 Rune of Al'Kabor 140
11754 Rune of the Combine 140
11758 Rune of the Helix 140
11773 Rune of Embrace 140
11774 Rune of Conception 140
11775 Rune of Infraction 140
11770 Rune of Petrification 142
11771 Rune of Tyranny 142
11772 Rune of Paralysis 142
11748 Rune of Attraction 162
11778 Rune of the Inverse 162
11779 Rune of Ap`Sagor 182
11763 Rune of Concussion 182
11782 Rune of Impetus 182
11783 Rune of Crippling 182
11781 Rune of the Astral 182
11880 Rune of Frost 182
11881 Rune of the Astral 182
11776 Rune of Rathe 182
65276 Rune of Druzzil 187
11780 Rune of Frost 200
-----------
65275 Rune of Draught 212
65290 Rune of Tallon Zek 212
65292 Rune of Transpose 212
65278 Rune of Fennin Ro 222
65283 Rune of Incendiary 222
65262 Rune of Alternation 227
65264 Rune of Antithesis 227
65265 Rune of Association 227
65266 Rune of Coalition 227
65267 Rune of Complexity 227
65268 Rune of Conglomeration 227
65269 Rune of Conjunction 227
65270 Rune of Cascade 227 + EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST
65271 Rune of Contradiction 227
65272 Rune of Coruscating 227
65273 Rune of Current 227
65274 Rune of Divergency 227
65277 Rune of Ellipse 227
65279 Rune of Flash 227 + EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST
65280 Rune of Gale 227
65281 Rune of Glint 227 + EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST
65282 Rune of Impulse 227 + EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST
65284 Rune of Incitation 227
65285 Rune of Incitement 227
65286 Rune of Opposition 227
65287 Rune of Prexus 227
65288 Rune of Scintillation 227
65289 Rune of Synergy 227 + EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST
65263 Rune of Amalgamation 255
65291 Rune of Tempest 255 + EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST
65293 Rune of Vortex 255 + EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST
65294 Rune of Zephyr 255

---
65270 Rune of Cascade 227 + EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST
65279 Rune of Flash 227 + EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST
65281 Rune of Glint 227 + EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST
65282 Rune of Impulse 227 + EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST
65289 Rune of Synergy 227 + EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST
65291 Rune of Tempest 255 + EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST
65293 Rune of Vortex 255 + EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST
16631 Rune of Coruscation EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST
11439 Rune of Greater Desiccation EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST
11442 Rune of Greater Conflagration EPIC 1.5 PREQUEST

 

This is amazing! With the revamped systems on live, it's nigh impossible to find lists like this through normal means (p99 only gets you to 182 or so), so really appreciate you aggregating it here

 

So uhh.... anyone got a spell research kit? Looks like the swatches, although they still work as a recipe, do not work in oldworld research containers, and Spell Research Kit are only available by PoK vendors that have been removed, or via zones that are no longer accessible: https://mqemulator.net/item.php?id=93492&view=soldby

This coincidentally makes the Wizard 1.5 impossible unless you already have a kit: https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/recipe.html?recipe=6250

I would check PEQ Database Editor to be sure of if there's a vendor that sells the research kit not listed on mqemulator, but guests do not have access to that function.

 

Ok so digging a bit more, it seems like Ikk4 is currently impossible unless you already have a Spell Research Kit purchased. Unless I'm misreading https://www.projecteq.net/edit/index.php?editor=tradeskill&ts=58&rec=10896 ?

I did see the swatches and GoD era research combines DO work in a Lexicon https://www.projecteq.net/edit/index.php?editor=tradeskill&ts=58&rec=571 - so that's fine, but yeah the Ikk4 combine currently requires a Spell Research Kit, but it's impossible to buy one. My suggestion would be to fix Ikk4 rune combine to work in oldworld research containers as well, just like other GoD era research combines do.